[g1or]

Greetings,

Yesterday late night, around 2 AM EST I was accused of Recruitment, which is of course disallowed on KR server. But I found the whole situation to be extremely unjust and baffling, since I have not once recruited anyone on KR server. The only time I even ever said the word "recruitment" was yesterday around 4-5 pm EST, when a random player after a long break from the game on KR asked me about CO, to whom I had replied with "its an old clan, went inactive but now we are gaining activity and recruiting". Following, I stated that that message was not an attempt to invite, nor anything of sorts, just a simple informative sentence (which can be easily confirmed by logs). Ever since my arrival on KR as a just player I have been following all the rules, including openly telling other players to do so as well when I see that rules are not being followed, despite the absence of any KR admins. It was very shocking to me that I was banned so quickly, without little to no consideration of the situation.
Another instance that came to my mind about potential reasons why the decision of banning was even made, was the fact that I asked a player named cR about 3 days ago in private messages if we could go to CO server, due to the simple reason of wanting to get to know him and showing him some of our CO modded servers. Once again, even in this instance no form of IP, or recruitment or anything of sorts was ever even mentioned to cR.
I am the kind of player that always follows rules, and happens to have couple decent relationships with some wonderful KR members and I respect your organization. I value integrity, therefore I would never willingly disrupt the order on the server or partake in any form of disallowed activities. I genuinely, no offense, think that this decision was unjust towards me and that's why I have decided to approach you with this message. And in advance, I'd like to apologize if somehow I did cross a line with anything, that was never my intent. Thank you in advance for reviewing my appeal.
Best wishes,
Master of the Chaos Order,
g1or

[Sakito]

It might surprise you to learn that it is illegal to sell drugs at school. But I have found a work-around. You buy a $300 Xbox and give that to your buddy who can give you $300 worth of drugs. Its not dealing that way...

Here is the equivant, your conversation on KR server: -

.:CØ|G1or:.: so are you clanless just chilling?
cR: totally clanless
.:CØ|G1or:.: playing for fun kinda thing
.:CØ|G1or:.: i see
cR: its the point of playing lol
cR: fun
.:CØ|G1or:.: give me your discord im trying to get people's discord so icant contact to pla yand talk ja wise
.:CØ|G1or:.: or i can give u mine
cR: give me yours
:CØ|G1or:.: ok
cR: i dont even use discord atm
.:CØ|G1or:.: XXXX#NNNN
cR: lol
.:CØ|G1or:.: oh i see
cR: but ill re activate it
.:CØ|G1or:.: well its justr certain things cant be discussed here on this server
.:CØ|G1or:.: we can also go to my clan server
.:CØ|G1or:.: its chaos order ++
.:CØ|G1or:.: to talk tthere
cR: i think i've seen it in the server list
cR: sure
.:CØ|G1or:.: yye its towards teh botttotm kinda ye
.:CØ|G1or:.: that
.:CØ|G1or:.: ok i am gonna go there now
.:CØ|G1or:. Disconnected
cR Disconnected

CØ|cR¹ Connected, player with same IP as cR


All we merely ask is to respect our space, and not steal from us.

Also please note, the /ammotd (Message of the day when you first join the server) says NO RECRUITING - it doesn't just mean limited to on-server chat. Stealing an item and taking it out of the window instead of the front door is still theft.

[g1or]

That's very funny you mention it, but a member of KR told me that I can ask for discords and not recruit, and that's what I did, I never talked of recruitment to cR on KR, which is your jurisdiction. After we went on to CO server for 2-3 hours or so, me and cR got to know each other, had lot's in common, I told him some things about CO that interested him, so we then came to a mutual understanding and a decision during our long stay on CO server that we wanted to check the clan out and join. I literally said in the logs you sent that there are certain things that can't be discussed on KR, which is another proof of me not wanting to cross lines and me consciously actively trying to keep it "legal". I am not trying to hurt anyone or discredit KR, I was simply getting to know a person, which I grew to like, and then on my clan server we decided he wanted to join us. None of those conversations were ever had on KR. I did not steal anyone, cR is not an item of clothing or a candy bar in a store, I never stole him from you and I think it is mildly disrespectful to refer to a person as an object in a store, cR is his own person and certainly is not a property of Knights Reborn. Despite that, he literally to this day continues to be active on KR. Also, you mentioned that recruiting is not limited to on-server chat, and that's right. So how does one go about getting to know a person, asking their discord etc. without getting banned, even if they were interested in him not only as a friend but a potential clanmate? I guess me asking if he is clanless was my downfall, but that in no form or shape was me trying to recruit him at that moment. I dueled cR almost every day for a week and we grew to like each other, simple as that.Every way you look at it, this is a misunderstanding and I stand by it, however once again I apologize for it and this situation truly bothers me, because I do not want to break KR rules or offend KR as an org. I can see how this could be misunderstood and how this could be considered to be a "grey area", and honestly if it is, once again, my apologies, I really hate to be in this position. And thank you for a speedy response, much appreciated.

[Sakito]

.:CØ|G1or:.: well its justr certain things cant be discussed here on this server
.:CØ|G1or:.: we can also go to my clan server
.:CØ|G1or:.: its chaos order ++
.:CØ|G1or:.: to talk tthere
cR: i think i've seen it in the server list
cR: sure
.:CØ|G1or:.: yye its towards teh botttotm kinda ye
.:CØ|G1or:.: that
.:CØ|G1or:.: ok i am gonna go there now
.:CØ|G1or:. Disconnected
cR Disconnected

CØ|cR¹ Connected, player with same IP as cR

^ Literally getting someone to leave our server with the intent to recruit.


Recruiting is actual theft. Reason being, running a server and a clan cost money. When a person recruits someone on a server that isn't theirs or gets someone to leave said server, they are stealing directly, real money from that clan who hosted the server with the goal of gathering their own recruits.


Again, I will reiterate. All we merely ask is to respect our space, and not steal from us.

[jawfin]

.:CØ|G1or:.: well its justr certain things cant be discussed here on this server

Please elaborate. Make sure what you say is in context.

[g1or]

Responding to Sakito's message:

I am well aware that running a server is not a free commodity, and I understand 100% that directly recruiting is not right on KR, but honestly, theft is such an exaggerated word in this case, with due respect, it's not like cR was about to join KR, let alone interested or considering it, which therefore makes him a normal neutral player that pitched in on to the only somewhat populous server in our most beloved but not a very active game. 95% of non-trolls gather on KR (and sometimes JAWA and few base servers I assume), and daily that's like what, maybe 50-70 separate players on average, or something along those lines, where half of them do not belong to KR. There is absolutely 0 chance of meeting people on other servers and getting to know them consistently due to a simple lack of opportunity. Me and cR have been dueling and talking on and off for days, and all I wanted is to show him how cool our modded maps on the server are because he likes modding and was interested in meeting people who can help him mod, and also ask some personal stuff as well. There is a hardcore filter on KR, cant cuss etc. talk about any subject isn't allowed, and on top of that if I simply were to want to discuss my clan that would have been an offense, as that can be seen as "promoting one's clan", which I wanted to avoid at all costs. So how else would I approach this situation? I do not ever want to have a KR member ban me (in case i'm ubanned that is, which would be greatly appreciated) for having a player leave and then come back with out tag after WOPPING 2-3 hours ! It is not as if he left and never came back, or is not going to continue being a respectful member of the KR server active community, he simply grew to agree with me on many life subjects, including the game itself and clan dynamics and our modded maps and that got him interested in our clan and rather being in one clan with me, once again I was simply getting to know him prior and nothing more, despite him ending up with us. Did I invite him to join us after getting to know him on KR for a week and then talking about private subjects on our own server? - Yes, I did invite him at the end on our own serve cause I grew to like him enough to be part of the org. Was it a primary intent? - Absolutely not, not in the slightest. Main reason was so that I could comfortably say whatever I want without sensors and show him our amazing modded maps. So does that mean that if somehow one happens to leave from a KR server after being asked to, with no tag and comes back later with our tag to KR after I have asked their discord I would be banned? You can be much much much sneakier and more discreet about asking people to go to another server, without having you guys know about it, but I was not hiding because I knew I was not recruiting him on your amazing server that I also enjoy playing on! The reason I am even asking or continuing to discuss this so adamantly about this subject is that I am interested in NOT making you guys go bankrupt and in following the rules, I want to avoid any confusion or acts of challenging the rules on KR servers and I want to continue being able to talk to my KR server acquaintances and friends and I really hope you understand where I am coming from and what I am trying to say here. I can assure you that I totally respect your point and I have taken it into consideration already, truly. I want to avoid such incidents in the future, I am not the enemy of KR let alone a thief. Thank you Sakito for your participation in this matter.

Responding to Jawfin:

I think I indirectly answered your request but even so, I'd like to relist my agenda about this whole chain of messages and give you a direct explanation and my thought process:
1) Asking if he was "clanless" - The reason I asked him that is because he was a strong dueler, felt like a ex-baser and I asked him if he was clanless due to the fact that there are many people that show up to KR without clan tags, I simply wanted to know how cR was such a decent player, which usually all good players are in clans. I was curious about him and how he grew to become a decent player, which is most often through being in a clan. For example, I have asked Yelawolf or Spice Runner same things, because they were great players. I was simply curious of their origins and of getting to know them,
2) "Certain things that can't be discussed on the server" - By that, I meant "I can not go around talking about my clan even in private messages because that is still promoting, therefore let's go away so I can cuss openly, not have to worry about sexual subjects or politics and also show you our modded maps. OH YEAH, and not have to worry about breaching tight KR guidelines". Simple as that, honestly.
3) He had no discord at all - Even in logs, I said I am trying to get discords off of people who are active, cause I wanted to get to know them and be able to contact them if I want to play with them, cR being one of some people I already got discords off of, including some KR members. And the reason why I even had him leave with me to our server was cause I could not talk to him through discord, cause the man simply did not have discord downloaded or registered. That's the sole reason apart from me having no filter and showing modded maps why I even had him leave the server, which Saki accused me of doing with the intent of recruitment. Recruitment was not even a thought yet at that stage. My intent was innocent and if you read my logs my words can fend for that.
Please if you need any other forms of specification or elaboration, please let me know I will be more than happy to provide my honest answers and genuineness. And thank you for being part of the process, I hope we can come to a resolution.

Personal message to all KR members and administration:

I can easily guarantee that I won't be having people leave your server with the intent to recruit or anything of sorts again because that was never my intent. I am back in the game after a decade-long break and I am still figuring out server dynamics and the community, and I love this game and the community, I simply want to continue my peaceful fun gaming experience on your public server. I can ensure you that I will do my best to not have such incidents ever again. Thank you for your audience and I hope you accept my apology and my reasoning alongside it.

-g1or

[Sakito]

Well, in terms of my involvement.
I'm the one who caught you because you quite literally did it right in front of me after we were done dueling!

Also just so you know. These "neutrals" you find on the KR server - our guests I should say. We see them as potentially someone who may be interested in joining our ranks (whether they show intent or not).

.:CØ|G1or:.: so are you clanless just chilling?
cR: totally clanless
.:CØ|G1or:.: give me your discord im trying to get people's discord so icant contact to pla yand talk ja wise
.:CØ|G1or:.: or i can give u mine
cR: give me yours
:CØ|G1or:.: ok


cR Disconnected

CØ|cR¹ Connected, player with same IP as cR

Moments later, cR reconnects with CO tags. This could be seen as recruitment!

.:CØ|G1or:.: we can also go to my clan server
.:CØ|G1or:.: its chaos order ++
.:CØ|G1or:.: to talk tthere
cR: i think i've seen it in the server list
cR: sure
.:CØ|G1or:.: yye its towards teh botttotm kinda ye
.:CØ|G1or:.: that
.:CØ|G1or:.: ok i am gonna go there now
.:CØ|G1or:. Disconnected

This part in particular was perceieved as taking away someone who has no prior history on the server. A guest!


Your intention was as you mentioned,

That's the sole reason apart from me having no filter and showing modded maps why I even had him leave the server

This "DOES" fall under recruiting, as it is actively taking away a guest from our server to go to another.


As you state though, your intent was innocent. I'm assuming you just didn't know and I understand that! I'm more than happy to give you the benefit of the doubt! Just clarifying this won't happen again.




We'd be more than happy to lift the ban!

[g1or]

Thank you very much, I appreciate the respect to deserve the benefit of the doubt, means a lot. But I do have a couple follow-up questions to make sure this never happens again Saki, just out my curiosity. I would be delighted if you guys answered them.

1) Is me offering someone to go to another server straight up against rules?
2) If God forbid I were to ask for someone's discord and they were to come on to the KR in future with our clan tags like situation with cR, would you consider that a breach of rules?
3) So pretty literally if somehow one of your "guests" end up to be members of another clan how do you go about that?

I do not expect answers to these questions nor im trying to provoke anyone, I just want to know it all about the matter, so I don't have to bother with another application for being unbanned ever again for something like this.

And once again, thank you so much for your kind treatment and understanding, see you on KR

[Key]

1) Yes
2) No, but see answer to #3
3) People join clans as they see fit, but if we have proof/reason to believe you are specifically using our community as your recruitment pool then the ban will be reinstated

This admin complaint has been resolved - please feel free to engage elsewhere on the forums/server!

~Locked~